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Bursitis of Right Knee
Started by: Brig DM Bahl at June 20 2009

Replies: 28 & Views: 18940    Font    Page 1 of 2  Goto page 1, 2  Next          Reply

   
Bursitis of Right Knee By: Brig DM Bahl
  
June 20 2009
Please advise homeo treatment for bursitis on back of right knee joint.

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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June 20 2009
Use Pulsatilla 30 and Bryonia 30 in morning and evening combination for three days. Thereafter continue with three doses of Ruta G 6X three times a day as long as required.

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Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: girilal
New Jersey USA
  
June 21 2009
Pl. also look at Rhododendron.

girilal

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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June 21 2009
YES. YES. YES.
WHAT A SURPRISE!!!!!!!!!!

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Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: nb1943
  
June 21 2009
Thanks. Please advise at what stage Rhododendron shud be taken, in which potency and how many doses.
She has already started wid Puls and Bry and will follow up with Ruta as advised.

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: Brig DM Bahl
  
June 21 2009
Thanks. Please advise at what stage Rhododendron shud be taken, in which potency and how many doses.
She has already started wid Puls and Bry and will follow up with Ruta as advised.

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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June 21 2009
Please wait for three days after Pulsatilla Bryonia Ruta G is given. If they cure, or improvement is seen there is no need for Rhododendron. Then Ruta G may be continued for a longer period alone. If not, Rhododendron may be given at 6C or 30C potency.

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Re: Bursitis of Right Knee By: Joe De Livera
Sri Lanka
  
June 22 2009
To Girilal

Welcome back.

Where are you located today ? India or US ?

Joe

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: Brig DM Bahl
  
June 27 2009
Dear Doctor,

We got her various blood tests carried out. All are within normal parameters except RA (Rheumatoid) which is positive.

Please advise remedy

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: M.A. Rana
  
June 27 2009
Dear Dr. Udaya Kumar / Joe
With all due respect to your suggestion i would like to add here my experience on the same. I have foud very good result with Corton tig. 30. One dose of this has given full result. Sulfur 200 one dose after that has closed the cheapter. Patients are perfect. No need of any other medicine.
This is all for your information and comments if any.

This is God who bless Life & health but no one else

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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June 27 2009
Dear Rana,

Thank you for sharing the hitherto unfamiliar area of clinical experience for me vis-a-vis Croton Tig. The characteristic action of Croton Tig is on ailments from body getting suddently cold after hot spell. which includes using water from the fridge after exposure to hot summer Sun, and diarrhea gushing out with force like water accompanied or not accompanied by sudden sore throat. and skin afflictions.

The other area of function is in Rhus Tox poisoning. Since all Rhus Tox poisoning should give Rhus tox symptoms and Rhus Tox symptoms being of great value in Arthritis, Gout, knee pain, inflammations of all kind, pains of all kinds, stoppage of air movements in any parts of the body, rheumatic,sciatic and all complaints of back and extremities according to symptoms. If Rhus poisoning is to be antidoted by Croton Tig, it should also cure all ailments which Rhus Tox can cure. That is was a wide area of function which has not been specified hitherto in Croton Tig symptoms and therefore worth a try to establish the complete symptom picture of Croton Tig.

Similarly, the aspect of cooling the body suddenly after being hot for sometime is a forbidden but often neglected area by most human beings. Heat and excessive burning of calories by running accounts for a dehydrated state and water is often used with urgency without allowing the body to cool down to normal temperature. It is like putting out fire while burning with water and leaves a lot of fumes. The endorphins created by such excessive heat of body is not put to use and therefore can be deposited as it is in the body.

Normally we advise that no water should be touched or drunk of should not walk on floor without foot protection soon after Yoga. Water is advised only after minimum of half an hour after Yoga. Warm milk are advised. Similarly after rigorous advised and after coming back from the hot sun, one need to wait a little for body to cool down. In the case of sun energy heating up the body, the cooling is faster whereas yogic energy is gradual heating up and gradual cooling down.

In all such cases, when we drink water the elders teach us not to do so by saying that it will break up the body. It can always create traps for the moving air. When body is heated, the air in the body tend to move upwards as natural tendency which is adjusted adquately by body by natural adjustments and no ill feelings are felt. Because it is in the property of the air or true nature of air to move upwards when heated. But sudden cooling contracts the muslces around the air as well as contracts the air, that the air gets trapped and movements gets restricted. Tightness all over the body is one such example, which is peculiar to Croton tig. When air is trapped, movements are restricted, when movements are restricted Rheumatism or Vata Dosha sets in. The Dosha is mostly seen in areas of bend and movements like joints. And therefore the knees, and small joints, become a focus for rheumatic pain. If Bursitis inflammation falls under one of these categories, Bursitis should be healed by Croton Tig. Yoiu can see that RA is the diagnosis above. The medicines of immediate value are for symptoms movement aggravate(RA), movement ameliorates,(Articular Arthritis, spondylosis, Ankylosing spondylosis, RA). My prescription is based on the Patient being female, correction of stomach, knee symptoms in Pulsatilla and pain on movement or movement aggravates in RA.

Rhodendron was agreed to because the patients the possible hailing from North India where the weather condition is very hot with Rheumatic ailments. The charactersitic Rhodendron symptoms being "rhematic and gouty symptoms well marked. Rheumatism in the hot season. The modality worse before a storm. That is again heating and cooling like Croton Tig and therefore, the patient dreads storm. The whole factor is lifted and placed here at a macrocosmic level from the body which is showing the microcosmic level of symptoms.

The Pulsatilla and Bryonia on the other hand is useful in all weather conditions. Because their area of functions are different. Bryonia works like a greese and oiling we give for a car to work smooth. It lubricates the joints with sufficient supply and regulated supply of mucuous. The dehydrated effects of the body therefore is neutralised in a natural manner by the medicine Bryonia.

I completely agree with your suggestion of Croton Tig. 30 and closing the chapter by Sulphur 200, though I have not tried this combination before on this particular set of ailments. Sulphur do complete most of the cure process started by other medicines.

Thank you.

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Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: Brig DM Bahl
  
June 28 2009
Very interesting discussion. Please rell me what remedy should I now administer for complete relief from disorders in the right knee.

Regards

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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June 28 2009
Since RA as usual is the triggering factors, with no history of trauma(injury) indicated by you,
and since being a lady no rigorous exercises or moving in the sun were expected of her considering and assuming that she is of elderly disposition, and considering the main sympto of bursitis is aggravation in movement, I would still suggest Pulsatilla 30, Bryonia 30 and Ruta G 30 three times a day for Bursitis and one dose of EITHER RHUS TOX 1M single dose OR APIS MEL 1M one single dose at the start of the treatment with no other medicine on that day (ACCORDING TO SYMPTOMS REMEBERING THAT APIS AND RHUS TOX ARE OPPOSITE IN FUNCTIONS AND SHOULD NOT BE USED TOGETHER OR ONE AFTER THE OTHER). Pulsatilla Bryonia and Ruta G can go well together. Since, Bryonia can Antidot Rhus Tox, it should not be given immediately after Rhus Tox. It should be started after three doses of Pulsatilla for one day. The next day you can use three doses of Bryonia 30 for one day. Continue with Ruta G for one week three times a day. If this therapy fails then only you need to go in for Rhodondron or Croton Tig with Sulphur. In case, you opt for Croton Tig with Sulphur I would like to know the outcome. Ruta G is for bruised bones and is beneficial in sall knee problems. with best wishes. with regards.

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Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: Brig DM Bahl
  
July 11 2009
Dear Doctor,

Thanks for yur advice.

RA is not the triggering factor becos about 6 months back RA was negative. Triggering factor has been an injury on back of her right knee about two years ago and a few weeks later, it suddenly got twisted while she was doing household work.

She has had intensive physiotherapy and medication to reduce pain as also to heal the injured ligament (ACL) and medial meniscus (cartilage). While pain killers do give relief but instability of joint, stiffness continues. Over the period swelling has appeared behind the knee which has been diagnosed Baker’s cyst/housemaid knee/bursitis.

She has felt some relief from Puls, Bryonia and Ruta but is still far from able to walk comfortably.

Please advise for further course of treatment.

Regards

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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July 11 2009
RA surfaces and subject to detecton in test after burst of the cyst. Sinovitis can also happen there which can surface austeoarthritis. But basically Vata Dosha is behind all this which can be visualised only if we follow the body minutely and not from the books.

The Medicine Ruta G is the best for the Housmaids knee/Bursitis. This should b continued. You can also get ointment of RutaG and apply over the area. Since you have mentioned about the injury and the possibility of cyst burst can bring in a clot wich complicates things three doses of Arnica 200C may be given. The best medicine is rest, keeping the leg raised and applying hot and cold applications simultaneously in many other systems of medicine. Applying that phlosophy here here (for e.g. turmeric in milk for drinking) Rana's Croton Tig is a fine replacement for the hot and cold applicaton. Sulphur 200 anyhow is required for completing the treatment.

Rhus Tox and Apis are equally helpful. Rhus Tox must b taken if movement relieves and Apis must be taken if there is swelling with pitting and red colour. If only red colour is there Rhus Tox will be more useful. One single dose in 1M is sufficient.

As far as ligaments and cartilages are concerned ruta will take care of it to a large extent but specifically for damage to ligaments and carteleges and for their regrowth which is a challenge in modern medicne but a possibility in homeopathy, Ledum Palustrum 30 and three doses of Causticum 30 may be used. Ledum Pal Q can be applied locally on the knee on the affected part for relief.

The follow up treatment must be with the following cell salts: Calcarea Fluor 6X, Calcaria Phos 6X and Silicea 6X in combinaton.

You may schedule these in most apropriate way. with best wishes and warm regards.

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Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: Brig DM Bahl
  
July 12 2009
Dear Doctor,

Thanks for your valuable advice. However, you have suggested so many useful remedies that it is difficult for me to make a suitable selection and decide their sequence for administration.

She feels acute pain behind the right knee when trying to stretch her leg. When standing, her knee does not take pressure. On walking, feels pain on lower left part of front knee cap. She has been able to walk short distance after taking Voveron 100 SR but that is no remedy.

X-ray and MRI reveal worn out cartilage, partial damage to ligament and Bakers cyst (housemaid knee) behind right knee. Left knee is perfectly normal so far.

You have mentioned Rhus Tox 1 M, Apis 1 M, Bryonia 30, Puls 30, Ruta 30 (Ruta ointment locally), Causticum 30, Ledum Pal 30 (Ledum P Q locally), Arnica 200, Sulphur 200, Croton Tig 30, Rhodendron 30. And Biochemic salts Calcarea Fluor 6X, Calcaria Phos 6X and Silicea 6X in combinaton.

As reported by me earlier, she has felt some relief from Puls, Bryonia and Ruta.

Homeopathic remedies for restoration of her worn out/torn cartilage, injured ligament and collection of fluid in the form of Baker’s Cyst, I am sure would meet the challenge and get her back her ability to walk smoothly and without pain.

I shall be grateful if you kindly choose the appropriate remedies and advise the sequence and frequency with which she should take.

Thanks and regards

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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July 12 2009
It will be a guess work eperiment if I zero down on a single medicine in the name of a disease. Homeo medicines do not treat names of diseases.

I would request you to fill the questionnaire and or help with the symptoms of each medicines from the link so that I can fine tune to minimum medicines:
www.homeoint.org/books/boericmm/index.htm

I can suggest four options:

1. Rhus Tox 1 M single dose
2. Causticum 30 three doses same day.
3. Continue with Ruta G.

wait for a day or two. Use one dose of Sulphur 200 wait for a day

4. Use one dose of Arnica 200.
Use 3 doses of Ledum 30 on the same day.
Ruta G will be continued. and Ledum to continue.

Apply Ruta G/Ledum Pal Q on site. Ruta is for bruised bones and tear and Ledum is for tendons and ligaments. They have different functions of repair work. Long term use of Ruta G is necessary. Ledum does its work faster, it can be discontinued and repeated later if found necessary. Ledum is also fine medicine for ascending RA

Second option according to symptoms of medicine.

1. Single dose of Apis Mel 1M
2. Arnica 200 single dose.
3. Bryonia 30 and Ruta G daily doses.and Ledum Pal daily doses.

Third option:
1. Rhododendron as suggested by Giri Lal .You could use it in 6C potency or 30C. Arnica 200 1 dose. Ruta G and Ledum Pal as above.


Other option:

Single dose of Croton Tig.
Single dose of Sulphur 200 as Suggested by Rana and report.

I can eliminate some of these medicines if complete feed back as requested earlier is given. With best wishes and regards.

--

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: Brig DM Bahl
  
July 12 2009
Thank you doctor,

I opened the link but it contains no questionnaire.

May be we can start with the first option where in she is given Rhus Tox 1 M followed by three dose of Causticum 30 on the same day.

From second day, I give her three doses of Ruta 30 daily for about three days.

Then give a gap of 2 days and she takes one dose of Sulphur 200.

Then after a gap of one day, she takes Arnica 200 followed by 3 doses of Ledum P on the same day.

Subsequently she takes two doses each of Ruta 30 and Ledum P 30 alternately for a few days.

Besides we shall apply Ruta/Ledum P on site twice daily.

This would complete First Option after which I shall report the result to you for further advice.

I hope I have understood your first option correctly and we can go ahead. I have freshly bought all the remedies today.

Thanks and regards

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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July 12 2009
The questonnaire is just above this box where you are posting the reply It says "Patients click here to present the whole picture". There are two ways of telling me. One is flling up the questionnaire above this box in this forum and submitting it. And the other is read the symptoms of the medicines from boericke materia medica and tell us which symptoms suits best to her symptom picture.

Now that you have decided upon the first option we can go by that. All are rejuvenative medicines. After Rhus Tox and Causticum she may find it very easy to walk. That should not be taken as cure and walk more than necessary. Unlike Articular Arthritis, she need to give the leg and knee rest because of injury. with best wishes.

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Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: Brig DM Bahl
  
July 13 2009
Thanks doctor,

Earlier you had also advised Calcarea Fluor 6X, Calcaria Phos 6X and Silicea 6X in combinaton along with other remedies. At what stage should these salts be taken?

Regards.

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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July 13 2009
Yes. I shall tell you when to take that on evolving symptoms and or improvements probably after Ledum is taken. with regards.

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Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: Brig DM Bahl
  
July 26 2009
Dear Doctor,

I administered to her the full course of remedies advised by you under Option One and completed it on 24 July. But there has been no relief and the painful condition remains unchanged.

Yesterday I gave her a single dose of Croton Tig 30. And this morning Sulphur 200.

The present condition of her right knee and leg is : Toes of right foot are numb, half the right foot has been numb for last two years may be because she had pain in the middle of her back; back of right knee containing sac of fluid (Bursitis) is painful, more in the morning when she tries to stretch her leg (goes worse during sleep more towards early hours of morning). Feels a bit better while walking.

She has pain at a few places in front of knee which do not allow her to put pressure on leg and she is unable to walk when these points are paining. These points are : 5-6 inches of inner side of knee and in the centre of front bend of knee (marked on pictures of her knee which I have uploaded with this post.) because of which she is unable to walk.

Her condition in her own words is-

“My whole knee is a ball of pain as if it is a broken knee from inside. My right leg on walking feels like a stick with no normal movements of the knee joint. The only medicine which gives lot of relief is allopathic Vovron 100 which if taken 2-3 times in a week enables me to walk without much discomfort in the house. With this even my limping stops. But still I cannot go for walks etc. If I try to walk more, the frontal points start giving pain.

“As I said, my knee is a ball of pain and it feels heavy. Out of the remedies suggested by you, I have taken some of them earlier also including Argentum Met 30, Bellis P 30, etc in the hope that my ligaments, cartilage and bones will get better but without any significant relief

“I have other problems also which have become chronic: – spondylosis, itching in the left scapula on my back and I am on citrizine for the past 17 years; Hypothyroid for the past 5 years; excess fatigue; immense hair loss; nodules of fat in legs, arms, left of the back, cystocele (stoppage of urine); and some times blood inside rectum. Some remedies like Canthris, Aloe and Sulphur etc have helped me a lot, but Thyroid, itching and knee condition are not curable it seems.

Orthopedic surgeons consider the joint spaces are about OK but because of problems surrounding the knee, they advise knee replacement so as to improve quality of life. But I want to get my knee cured by Homeopathy.”

Based on the above, please advise further course of treatment.

Thanks and regards

PS: Unable to upload pictures. If I can have your email id, I shall email these to yu.

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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July 26 2009
I need to reevaluate your case in the light of all those new details you have given. As per the present symptoms you have given, there is also a sciatic nerve involvement which is giving numbness to the toe which has direct bearing with the spondylosis. There is also austeoarthritc degeneraton as per the pain point you are mentioning. If Voveron 100 is helping her as an analgecic then what she should do is to add a medicine which can Regenerate the lost ligaments and tissues. I can suggest you two medicines which are exceptionally good in that i.e.Nutralite Glucosamine HCI and Double or Triple X of Nutralite which are multivitamins and supplements by Amway. You may see it in the following link.
www.nutrilite.com/en-us/Nature/Products/glucosamine.aspx


In homeo medicines Arnica and RutaG can continue and occassional Causticum. For itching in the back use Pulsatilla 200 or colchicum 30.

You can post to my mail udaya54@in.com

with regards.

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Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: Brig DM Bahl
  
July 27 2009
Dear Doctor,

Today I have emailed some pictures and scans of X-ray and MRI images. I hope these would be useful in re-evaluation of the case.

Thanks and regards

Re:Bursitis of Right Knee By: udaya kumar
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July 27 2009
I have seen the MRI and Xray. My impressions are apart from the Radiologists' findings, it seems that the joint capsule has lighly herniated into the back of the knee due to the tear of the meniscal cartilage of the knee. This has resulted in the Baker's cyst. The transillumination is indicative that the mass is filled with fluid and it should go away if she keeps the legs raised.

2. The pain in the inside of the knees as indicated by you with a long line is indicative of osteoarthritis, as already told by me in earlier posts. That is also indicative of sciatic nerve involvement.

3. The green web like vericose veins indicates the necessity for three medicines i. Calcarea Fluor 2. Hypericum. iii. Arnica.

i. Calcarea Fluor is required as it is indicative of ostephytes deposits and possible spikes or caries which is interfering with nerves and may be the sciatic nerve too.

ii. Hypericum is required here for strengthening the nerves

iii. Arnica is required here for possible Deep Vein Thrombosis which should be aborted by infrequent doses of Arnica 30.

4. Swelling above the knees indicate the need for two medicines :
i. Phosphorus
2. Apis Mellifica or Rhus Tox. Since Rhus Tox did not give us the desired result earlier Apis Mel 1M one dose may be tried.

5. The main medicines for the Bursitis and all maladies together remain Pulsatilla and Bryonia with Ruta G.

6. If there is pain either Belladonna 200C in split doses or Neproxin(Proxin) in Allopathy could be given.

With best wishes.

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